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Old 07-15-2014, 03:25 AM   #21
richard1726
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I bought a new Outback in 2000 and now have 290,000 miles on it. There is some rust showing and I only have one original wheel bearing. Only buy genuine Subaru parts when replacing parts, noting else will hold up. The top has recieved, bikes-2, canoe + bikes! And a large very arrow dynamic roof top fiberglass pod, (one set at a time). The only thing that has gone bad were the water channels from the twin moon roofs, I just sealed them permanently and disconnected the switch.
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Old 07-15-2014, 10:10 AM   #22
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Justin, You seem to have a picture for any occasion! How do you do it?
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Old 07-15-2014, 10:38 AM   #23
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Drove a Legacy wagon in the mountains for a few years. It will get you where you're going, not kill your wallet in the process and haul all you necessities, whatever you perceive them to be. If your stuff won't fit, you simply have too much stuff I left the Adirondacks in that little car. Loaded it with two beagles, my small gun collection, and all the tools I could fit. Turned the key and headed south....
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Old 07-15-2014, 11:24 AM   #24
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I'm a Toyota man myself, they've always been very good to me- but Subarus are good, dependable vehicles- and as an earlier post reported, the 4WD aspect is a big part of it, along with good gas mileage. Stick with what works for ya.
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Old 07-15-2014, 12:18 PM   #25
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OK....enough Subaru love-fest. I am from Northern NY and I understand the attraction...cheap (not anymore) all wheel drive is what embedded these in the North Country. Realistically, they were a poor mans alternative to the superior AWD offered on Audi vehicles. Audi was only available in Cornwall or Syracuse so when the Subaru's became available, they became quite popular fairly quickly and especially with the university crowd in Pdam, Canton etc. They snuck in from Vermont kind of like some kind of invasive species. In Vermont they grew in popularity due to the cheaper AWD vs. the even more prevalent (back in the 80s/90s) Audi. And of course Audi had some issues with self acceleration that hurt them in the market for a while...enter Subaru.
That said, and from experience, they are noisy, prone to motor issues, head warpage, super sensitive and poorly designed emissions systems that are expensive to fix if you can find someone that can figure them out. Clutches require truck driver legs to engage and they are also prone to failure. For a canoeist the rack system is totally inadequate since the roof mounts are not designed to carry the loads that you get when you carry a canoe never mind a couple of them. I don't get the attraction. I will never own one. I have had numerous Audi's and now drive Volvo's. I consider them to be superior to the relatively primitive, never mind horribly ugly "suuby's".
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Old 07-15-2014, 05:56 PM   #26
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I LOVE my Forester!!! A great vehicle to enjoy the great outdoors....







Take it easy,
Bob
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Old 07-15-2014, 06:39 PM   #27
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Justin, You seem to have a picture for any occasion! How do you do it?
I enjoy spending a lot of time in the Adks, and taking of bunch of photos.
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Old 07-15-2014, 09:03 PM   #28
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Notice Bob's Forester? No factory racks.. He's using good aftermarket racks. My Forester came with nekkid roof to as I wanted.

There isn't an Audi dealer for 100 miles.
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Old 07-15-2014, 09:51 PM   #29
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Nerd vehicle of choice!
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Old 07-15-2014, 10:23 PM   #30
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OK....enough Subaru love-fest. I am from Northern NY and I understand the attraction...cheap (not anymore) all wheel drive is what embedded these in the North Country. Realistically, they were a poor mans alternative to the superior AWD offered on Audi vehicles. Audi was only available in Cornwall or Syracuse so when the Subaru's became available, they became quite popular fairly quickly and especially with the university crowd in Pdam, Canton etc. They snuck in from Vermont kind of like some kind of invasive species. In Vermont they grew in popularity due to the cheaper AWD vs. the even more prevalent (back in the 80s/90s) Audi. And of course Audi had some issues with self acceleration that hurt them in the market for a while...enter Subaru.
That said, and from experience, they are noisy, prone to motor issues, head warpage, super sensitive and poorly designed emissions systems that are expensive to fix if you can find someone that can figure them out. Clutches require truck driver legs to engage and they are also prone to failure. For a canoeist the rack system is totally inadequate since the roof mounts are not designed to carry the loads that you get when you carry a canoe never mind a couple of them. I don't get the attraction. I will never own one. I have had numerous Audi's and now drive Volvo's. I consider them to be superior to the relatively primitive, never mind horribly ugly "suuby's".
Actually I prefer my Rolls Royce. High enough off the ground to get me anywhere and my chauffeur really knows how to drive it. What really is cool is that not having to do the driving myself I can thumb my nose at all those other drivers of inferior vehicles.

However, when I really want to put on the dog, I give the chauffeur the day off and get the Lamborghini out of the garage. I love the envious look of all those poorer folk as I fly past them on the Northway.
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Old 07-15-2014, 11:12 PM   #31
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Notice Bob's Forester? No factory racks.. He's using good aftermarket racks. My Forester came with nekkid roof to as I wanted.
Out of curiosity, why do you prefer the naked roof/aftermarket racks? I guess I always assumed OEM roof rails and/or cross bars would be more durable and less like to fall off.

I'm hoping to get an Outback or Forester for my next car (currently have a FWD Pontiac Vibe with OEM roof rails and Inno crossbars). Won't be for a few years though unfortunately
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Old 07-15-2014, 11:51 PM   #32
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Out of curiosity, why do you prefer the naked roof/aftermarket racks? I guess I always assumed OEM roof rails and/or cross bars would be more durable and less like to fall off.

I'm hoping to get an Outback or Forester for my next car (currently have a FWD Pontiac Vibe with OEM roof rails and Inno crossbars). Won't be for a few years though unfortunately
Not necessarily true. The car makers sell cars and the roof racks are "extras" so it's something their engineers who specialize in automobiles design.

However when you buy from companies like Thule or Yakima who specialize in roof racks you're getting a product engineered specifically to hold equipment of one kind or another on the roof of a vehicle. Therefore you get a better engineered and more efficient product.
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Old 07-16-2014, 06:27 AM   #33
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Out of curiosity, why do you prefer the naked roof/aftermarket racks? I guess I always assumed OEM roof rails and/or cross bars would be more durable and less like to fall off.

I'm hoping to get an Outback or Forester for my next car (currently have a FWD Pontiac Vibe with OEM roof rails and Inno crossbars). Won't be for a few years though unfortunately
No.. They used to be more flimsy and when I worked at a paddleshop we would never load boats onto a customers OEM racks. There had been an unhappy circumstance when a OEM rack failed and broke and the customer sued the shop..unsuccessfully but still a PITA.
Those show racks are not designed for boats.

In thirty years of using Yakima racks I have not had one just fall off.
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Old 07-16-2014, 06:29 AM   #34
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Out of curiosity, why do you prefer the naked roof/aftermarket racks? I guess I always assumed OEM roof rails and/or cross bars would be more durable and less like to fall off.

I'm hoping to get an Outback or Forester for my next car (currently have a FWD Pontiac Vibe with OEM roof rails and Inno crossbars). Won't be for a few years though unfortunately
Check the owners manual and see if it lists the load ratting for your current cars rack. You might be surprised at the value. I have a feeling car manufacturers are purposefully making their racks side rails smaller and smaller all the time so that we cannot carry boats on top of our cars.
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Old 07-16-2014, 11:57 AM   #35
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Why not OEM?

Most OEM roof systems will not adequately support the loads that canoeists, cyclists tend to carry on their cars. Subaru, Ford, GM, Toyota, Honda factory units are more cosmetic than functional. There are also issues with the "wheel base" in many of the OEM systems. They are too short to properly spread the load.

For such cases and also for cars not equipped with an adequate system the Yakima or Thule systems offer a better alternative. I have used Yakima since 1983 and started with their gutter mount systems. I used the same racks until 1999 and still use some of the components from that set. The gutter mounts were actually Yakima’s best product until they introduced the Rail Grabbers (more on that later). The gutter mounts squared to the car and the cross bars with very little effort and since they locked on to the gutters very precisely they could easily be removed and replaced on the car with minimal effort. The initial installation was very easy since the only adjustment was the bar overhang.
Yakima addressed the cars without gutter mounts with the Control Towers and then Q Towers. I have had both and still own three sets of these. They are the best solution available for a roof that comes without an adequate factory rail. I have had these on several old Volvos and Audis and until they introduced the Rail Grabbers, these were my first preference. That said, they are not fun to use. Getting Control Towers perfectly set on a small roof with rounded surfaces will highlight serious design shortcomings. The landing pads need to make as much contact with your roof line as possible to properly spread load and to keep them from slipping around on your roof. Getting them to the exact right position and mounting the towers as far forward and back as possible simply taxes the design to it’s limits. Some vehicles have a centering hole in the door channel that a pin in the Q Clip can grab. These help to set the alignment and keep the clips from sliding but since they center in the door frame, the distance that you end up with between cross bars is very short and inadequate for carrying a large canoe. To overcome this you need to move the towers forward on the front door and to the back on the rear. When you do that, the clips do not grab as well and the rack can slips around on the roof. While all of this pad adjustment is going on you still need to fool with the position of the cross bar controlling it’s side to side location but also the theta around the tower. It’s a major PITA since the cams that tighten the cross bar bury in the bars coating and affect adjustments and also affect the overall position. Once you get it, don’t move it….. That said, these will slip on your roof and over time the pads will rot away and stick to your roof and leave forever marks on it. They need constant monitoring to make sure they are tight. And if this all works without a leak in your door gaskets…hoo ha… Yakima will give you replacements for the stick on material that always puckers up and lets water drip under your gaskets...no charge.
I suppose the squarish roof lines on a Forester might work better with these but the spacing between the bars is still very short? I can't imagine these with a 20 foot canoe.
Back to the roof rails…..the rail grabbers are the best thing Yakima has ever made. If you have a good roof rail system to mount these on, they set up in minutes. All of the craziness that comes from the control towers and landing pads and clips is eliminated. All you need to do is position them front and back, side to side and tighten them down. I leave these on my cars year round and only remove them to put my longer cross bars (for 3 canoes) on. The grabbers do not have as many metal parts as the Q Towers so another advantage is that you don’t have the rust and corrosion issues that plague that design. These are another thing Yakima will replace if you ask them to.
I buy old Volvo wagons and since they don’t always come with the roof rails, I add them. Erie Vovo in Whitesboro usually has a set or two available. The Volvo wagons all have removable roof strips that expose the mounting studs for the rails. The Volvo roof line is a pretty rugged landscape and the rail mounts are no exception. The lugs are heavy duty welded locations. The rails are torqued on with pretty good sized metric bolts. After the rails are mounted, the roof strips (trimmed to fit) can be replaced so that it all looks factory. You can get the replacement clips from Volvo. I have no qualms about hauling three canoes or a boat on the roof at thruway speeds and maybe plus a bit as necessary.
As I write this I have decided to sell off the rest of my Yakima tower sets. I have Track Rack on my truck and I will only use the rail grabbers from now on……I wonder if there are Q Clips for Rolls and Lambo’s available?

Last edited by mgc; 07-16-2014 at 05:04 PM..
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Old 07-16-2014, 01:58 PM   #36
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As I write this I had decided to sell off the rest of my Yakima tower sets. I have Track Rack on my truck and I will only use the rail grabbers from now on……I wonder if there are Q Clips for Rolls and Lambo’s available?
Custom made. Carbon Fiber with "LOOK AT ME!!" engraved in Platinum..
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Old 07-16-2014, 02:05 PM   #37
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I used to have a Outback. It was great in the snow. Ground clearance wasn't too hot. I seldom drove it on my rocky camp road. My Jeep is all I use there. Nice clearance and good in 4 wheel drive but terrible in the snow in 2 wheel drive. When it dies I'll get a Forrester I hear they have a high ground clearance.
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Old 07-16-2014, 04:57 PM   #38
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Custom made. Carbon Fiber
That would definitely keep them from rusting out......................
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Old 07-16-2014, 05:47 PM   #39
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The OEM roof racks are too narrow and too weak. One of the reasons I bought the base model Forester was to get a naked roof so I could put on nice, wide Thule racks for hauling two canoes. The rack spacing is a little close, but I have no problems with my 18' canoe.

IIRC, the Thule racks screwed onto the OEM rack sockets are rated for a 200lb. load. That's a lot....

The Forester goes like a darn snowmobile in the snow, gets pretty nice mileage on the highway, and has no problem towing my 1900 lb. bass boat rig.

Good paddling,
Bob
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Old 07-16-2014, 06:59 PM   #40
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I wasn't able to definitively find the load limit of my roof online, some sites say 75lbs but they don't specify if that's for the roof rails or the OEM crossbars. My Inno crossbars and feet (similar to the Yakima rail grabbers, even more similar to the Thule Crossroad feet) are rated to 140lbs which is much more than what my single kayak weighs. Haven't had an issue with them moving or anything yet. But it's something to think about when I start looking to purchase a new car
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