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Old 11-30-2012, 02:17 PM   #1
Commissionpoint
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NYSDEC & LGPC Duke it out over invasives

http://poststar.com/news/local/state...a4bcf887a.html

To me its sounds like it all comes down to money. DEC doesn't want to spend the money. (They don't have it.) So the policy makers send Kathy Moser out there with some specious arguements about using self inspection stations as an equivelant alternative.

While not a huge fan of the LGPC, I think this is one arguement they are on the right side of.
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Old 11-30-2012, 03:08 PM   #2
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I'm not too familiar with the specifics of the situation, but I will say this. Situations like invasive species in Lake George arise due to ignorance more than anything else. As a whole, our society largely lacks an environmental ethic, at least one strong enough to really protect all of our resources, not just a few certain areas that we deem important by some arbitrary criteria.

In situations like this, we are reaching the point where it's going to take a pretty severe wake up call for everyone involved before we get our act together and do anything about it. Whether or not that wake up call takes the form of placing the financial burden for environmental impacts directly upon those responsible for creating those impacts remains to be seen.
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Old 11-30-2012, 03:14 PM   #3
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I don't know the specifics of the Lake George situation either, but our State requires each powerboater to purchase an invasives sticker for a few dollars. That funds inspections done at many of the most popular launches, and also funds some boat wash stations. The inspections are done by trained volunteers, usually on weekends and summer holidays.

Funds have also gone to allow purchase of invasive removing machinery. In our area that is mostly aquatic plants.

So I am not sure why the DEC and local organizations are butting heads; seems it might be more productive to work together. There has to be more than one potential solution.
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Old 11-30-2012, 04:59 PM   #4
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So I am not sure why the DEC and local organizations are butting heads; seems it might be more productive to work together. There has to be more than one potential solution.
Its actually two different state entities. One is regional and the other statewide.

The makeup and charter of the LGPC is a pretty complex thing. Recently courts ruled that thier authority trumps that of the local municipalities along the waterfront.

They do a lot of good things, but as with most boards like this, politics have a way of working thier way into the system and gumming things up. You can learn more about their regulations, programs, and policies here.

http://www.lgpc.state.ny.us/index.html
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:23 AM   #5
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We had a paid Steward at Cranberry Lake this past summer. He was a college student from Paul Smiths paid thru a grant program.
He did a great job .
My only concern was that he wasn't able to work 24/7.
In a perfect world, I would love see a paid steward at every boat launch in the state equipped with a wash down pump and with police powers to enforce a mandatory wash down for all boats being launched.
I think it would be cheaper to pay for prevention than for remediation.
Perhaps it is time to charge for use of launch ramps......
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Old 12-01-2012, 11:41 AM   #6
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We had a paid Steward at Cranberry Lake this past summer. He was a college student from Paul Smiths paid thru a grant program. He did a great job .


My only concern was that he wasn't able to work 24/7.
In a perfect world, I would love see a paid steward at every boat launch in the state equipped with a wash down pump and with police powers to enforce a mandatory wash down for all boats being launched.
I think it would be cheaper to pay for prevention than for remediation.
Perhaps it is time to charge for use of launch ramps......
Go Bobcats!!!

I agree prevention is a lot easier and less costly than remediation. This particular debate and how it ends up playing out may have impact on policy in other places so its one we should all be paying attention to.
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Old 12-01-2012, 08:00 PM   #7
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I paddled on the NYC reservoirs in the Catskills this summer. You had to take your boat (no power boats on these reservoirs) to a vendor who steamed cleaned the boat, including your paddles, and then placed a sticker on your boat good for the day and the reservoir. If you leave your boat at a particular reservoir, you only need to get steam cleaned once. Since I paddled on 2 different resevoirs, I needed to do it twice. At both launches, I was stopped, asked to show my permit and show the sticker indicating my boat had been cleaned. I think it was $16 each day
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Old 12-02-2012, 01:30 PM   #8
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I knew it wouldn't take long.

http://poststar.com/news/local/warre...a4bcf887a.html

Its already moved beyond just Lake George. Now all of Warren County is considering it. Those who like to paddle the Schroon or Hudson, hike in to Jabe Pond, etc. will be affected under this proposal. Also interesting to note is that the draft specifically includes language to approch neighboring counties to persuade them to pass similar legislation.
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Old 12-03-2012, 12:00 AM   #9
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My understanding of both the mandatory boat wash program the LGPC hopes to implement and the law Warren county hopes to put in place is that it will exclude canoes and kayaks.

The article in the Post Star appears to confirm that:

Quote:
It would affect all trailered boats, but not kayaks and canoes.
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Old 12-03-2012, 05:09 AM   #10
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Thats good to point out, but I think its something that needs to be paid attention to. These things have a way of changing many times before they are made final.
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:28 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by peskypup View Post
My understanding of both the mandatory boat wash program the LGPC hopes to implement and the law Warren county hopes to put in place is that it will exclude canoes and kayaks.

The article in the Post Star appears to confirm that:
But why will it exclude these? Seems that if they wanted to control the invasive species they should do all. My canoe goes in more water bodies then my motorized boat.
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Old 12-03-2012, 11:07 AM   #12
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http://des.nh.gov/organization/commi...ents/bb-62.pdf


Many many more nooks and crannies in a powered craft for the clam juveniles to harbor. Same with invasive plants.. plant fragments get stuck in motor parts.
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Old 12-03-2012, 05:17 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by yellowcanoe View Post
http://des.nh.gov/organization/commi...ents/bb-62.pdf


Many many more nooks and crannies in a powered craft for the clam juveniles to harbor. Same with invasive plants.. plant fragments get stuck in motor parts.
May be true but if you truly want to stop the spread you need to treat every chance of the spread not just some. Kind of like the emeral ash bore. You can't take firewood more then I believe 50 miles from where it's cut without issues but you can haul logs and chips all over. If you want to halt the spread of any of these things you have to go after everysource no matter how small.
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:23 PM   #14
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Logistically though it makes little sense to try and catch every canoe on the lake. On my home lake there are some 300 canoes and kayaks. Most never even see a launch ramp.

They are cartopped in and launched at residences. We do have an aggressive invasive plant program. Many of these same residents have littoral sectors of the lake to patrol. It is a community effort. Not just from "on high"
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Old 12-04-2012, 10:00 AM   #15
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During the past summer, At Cranberry Lake, some people attempted to launch a used "foreign" floating dock segment that was covered with Asian clams. The steward informed them of the issue and they proceeded to scrape off the clams, bleach the dock, and then to not launch for a week. The dock had been out of the water for a year also. They wanted to play it as safe as possible.

It later came to be known, that the chemistry of the lake water has an impact also. For some reason, I think lack of calcium, Cranberry would not be a good host for clams...

Each lake would have its' own issues depending....
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Old 12-05-2012, 08:07 AM   #16
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During the past summer, At Cranberry Lake, some people attempted to launch a used "foreign" floating dock segment that was covered with Asian clams. The steward informed them of the issue and they proceeded to scrape off the clams, bleach the dock, and then to not launch for a week. The dock had been out of the water for a year also. They wanted to play it as safe as possible.

It later came to be known, that the chemistry of the lake water has an impact also. For some reason, I think lack of calcium, Cranberry would not be a good host for clams...

Each lake would have its' own issues depending....
Just another example why it needs to be all or none. We need to take the problem seriously and no matter if it hits our pocketbooks or not canoes kayaks all boats docks etc need the same rules.
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Old 12-05-2012, 10:45 AM   #17
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I like the dock example a lot. Not everyone can or wants to afford new. That pushes them into the secondary market and an infestation is just as easilly caused by a dock as it is a boat that was taken from contaminated waters.

So really. If protection from invasives is the goal there shoudn't be any exceptions because not only does it undermine the entire spirit of the undertaking it also unfairly penalizes one group of users while other groups can act with impunity circumventing the whole purpose of the program in the process.
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Old 12-06-2012, 10:51 PM   #18
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A couple decent editorials on the topic from this week:

http://blog.timesunion.com/opinion/l...elp-now/23208/

http://www.denpubs.com/news/2012/dec...invasives-now/
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