Adirondack Forum  
Rules Membership Donations and Online Store Adkhighpeaks Foundation ADKhighpeaks Forums ADKhighpeaks Wiki Disclaimer

Go Back   Adirondack Forum > The Adirondack Forum > Hunting and Fishing in the Adirondacks
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 03-25-2017, 01:33 PM   #21
Cpswing555
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 51
MGC that was a good point about those scrubby ones. Like I said everything has its flaws. Now just to clarify, we have no point restrictions for junior and senior hunters along with active military. So it does not have an effect on kids, but the one problem I am seeing is scubs. I had three spikes go by me in one morning two years ago and four this year. It's almost like you need to drop the restriction every 3 years or so, or make a push for hunters to whack these little scrubs for a couple of years to get them out of the gene pool. Tough to do and hard to pass I know. Just telling you all some of the things I see.

CP
Cpswing555 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2017, 01:49 PM   #22
mgc
Member
 
mgc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 233
I named one of the deer that I had to pass on 2 years ago (during the mandated antler-less bow restriction) Mr. Twister.
He has two prongs facing the front and two facing to the rear....what an odd rack... I saw him a three years ago when he was still an puppy so I know that he's at least a three year old deer....Nice mass, lot's of good venison but not harvestable under an antler restriction... Next year with any kind of luck he'll present a nice 20 yard quartering away shot.........
I will happily use my tag on him.
mgc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2017, 02:22 PM   #23
geogymn
Member
 
geogymn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,674
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpswing555 View Post
MGC that was a good point about those scrubby ones. Like I said everything has its flaws. Now just to clarify, we have no point restrictions for junior and senior hunters along with active military. So it does not have an effect on kids, but the one problem I am seeing is scubs. I had three spikes go by me in one morning two years ago and four this year. It's almost like you need to drop the restriction every 3 years or so, or make a push for hunters to whack these little scrubs for a couple of years to get them out of the gene pool. Tough to do and hard to pass I know. Just telling you all some of the things I see.

CP
I think we should give any viable deer an IQ test and only then we can harvest them if they go beyond a certain threshold. The threshold will be described in this year restriction Manuel which is availble in PDf form by clicking here -//-
__________________
"A culture is no better than its woods." W.H. Auden
geogymn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2017, 04:32 PM   #24
Hard Scrabble
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 999
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgc View Post
Yes and no....rack hunters will pass until they get the horns the want. The issue is the hunter that wants to put a deer in the freezer that will be forced to pass on 3 and 4 points.....
Young hunters will be especially compromised as will be hunters that cannot devote the amount of time it takes to being that selective.

And selfishly, on my property I have a genetic pool that pushes through two and four horned deer....ugly racks but decent sized deer. I harvest them when they present themselves..... During the antler-less mandate a few years ago I had three of these woeful racks within range during the first week of bow season. I had to let them walk.. I never saw other deer until December...

Let the hunter make the choice and let NYS Senate work on something meaningful that creates jobs, lowers taxes, improves our infrastructure etc.....
I agree.
Hard Scrabble is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2017, 01:17 PM   #25
Buckladd
Member
 
Buckladd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Hogtown
Posts: 623
Statewide sportsman's groups are against this, mostly because it remove's DEC's authority. Also in the budget are bills to lower the legal big game hunting age to 12 (rifle/shotgun/crossbow) and also to put crossbow regulations in the hands of DEC, not politicians. This governor is usually on time with the budget so we should know what's up by the end of this week.
__________________
Life's short, hunt hard!
Buckladd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2017, 04:14 PM   #26
Hard Scrabble
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 999
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckladd View Post
Statewide sportsman's groups are against this, mostly because it remove's DEC's authority. Also in the budget are bills to lower the legal big game hunting age to 12 (rifle/shotgun/crossbow) and also to put crossbow regulations in the hands of DEC, not politicians. This governor is usually on time with the budget so we should know what's up by the end of this week.
Politics aside, I don't think that a 12 year old kid, however precocious, can realize the taking the life of an animal.
That's only my thought, guys.
Jim
Hard Scrabble is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2017, 08:35 AM   #27
Buckladd
Member
 
Buckladd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Hogtown
Posts: 623
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hard Scrabble View Post
Politics aside, I don't think that a 12 year old kid, however precocious, can realize the taking the life of an animal.
That's only my thought, guys.
Jim
I can only speak for myself and in my household guns and hunting were second nature, but with a large amount of due respect. I was more than ready to hunt deer when I was 12 but I admit I had experienced things at that age that my peers had not. I've been out with several 12-year-olds and kids other ages on youth turkey hunts and have seen them react differently to the kill. I think a lot of it has to do with their surroundings up to that point in their life.
__________________
Life's short, hunt hard!
Buckladd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2017, 10:59 AM   #28
Stillhunter
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 211
I agree with Buckladd, some 12 year olds are definitely ready to start deer hunting at 12. It is a function of their exposure growing up and how they were mentored by parents, relatives, friends and taught to handle and respect guns and wildlife.
I also think that there are some 12 year olds who are not ready to be deer hunting at this age. This may be a function of lack of exposure, mentoring and participation in their early years. Supervised hunting as the current youth regulation requires is the correct way to get youth involved.
Going small game hunting with my Dad as soon as I was able to walk behind him and being exposed to trapping at an early age made a big difference for me and my brothers. It was a gift that I will always be thankful to my father for.

As 12 years of age relates to this thread, the last thing our young hunters (whether 12 or 17) need to have forced on them is antler restrictions. This takes away from the hunt and promotes a trophy mentality that says to them small bucks are not trophies when they certainly are.
The bill would impact all hunters 17 and older. Some of my most memorable hunts from the beginning up to the present day resulted in a spike, fork horn or small six pointer that would not have been possible under the proposed AR law. These deer are just as meaningful to my hunting memories as some of the bigger antlered deer I have been blessed to take over the years.
I say let's enable our young hunters to enjoy hunting for the complete hunting experience and that includes the ability to enjoy a successful hunt where they can take a beautiful young buck! Giving only one or two years exemption from AR's does not help them experience the hunt and only teaches the wrong values.
Stillhunter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2017, 01:27 PM   #29
Bounder45
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 195
I don't agree that going after bigger animals, with bigger racks, can necessarily be labeled as a "trophy mentality." And for that matter, I think the "trophy mentality," while it perhaps exists in some form, means a lot of different things to different people. Bear hunters routinely go after the bigger, older boars; perhaps there is a little bit of the "bigger is better" mentality going on, but removing the older boars also gives the younger bears, especially cubs, a better chance to survive, grow and breed. Should we consider this trophy hunting? There are ecological benefits to removing the older animals and giving the younger ones a few more seasons, outside of simple "trophy" motivations.

The same holds true for deer in my opinion. I'd rather take an older buck that has been around the block a few times, than take a young one that has barely had a chance to compete in the rut. The bigger rack is a nice bonus, though it's not something I put too much stock in. I'm sure there are other hunters who are purely focused on the rack size. Either way, there is some ecological benefit to allowing the younger bucks grow a little and taking the older ones out.

I do agree that this AR bill may not be the best way to address this issue.
Bounder45 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2017, 03:48 PM   #30
Hard Scrabble
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 999
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckladd View Post
I can only speak for myself and in my household guns and hunting were second nature, but with a large amount of due respect. I was more than ready to hunt deer when I was 12 but I admit I had experienced things at that age that my peers had not. I've been out with several 12-year-olds and kids other ages on youth turkey hunts and have seen them react differently to the kill. I think a lot of it has to do with their surroundings up to that point in their life.
I agree with your post. I also grew up with a respect for firearms and hunting.
My point is that today, few 12 year olds have the conception of taking a life.
They watch video games where death has no consequence, human or otherwise.
I would advocate mature guidance for young hunters.
Jim
Hard Scrabble is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2017, 10:10 PM   #31
Stillhunter
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 211
Many seasoned hunters mature to the point where they seek the challenge of pursuing older age animals. It should be each hunters personal choice and not mandated by law. This bill is rooted in trophy hunting and control of all hunters to get there.
Stillhunter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2017, 04:31 PM   #32
Hard Scrabble
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 999
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stillhunter View Post
Many seasoned hunters mature to the point where they seek the challenge of pursuing older age animals. It should be each hunters personal choice and not mandated by law. This bill is rooted in trophy hunting and control of all hunters to get there.
Control is inside, or should be, of every hunter.
Jim
Hard Scrabble is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2017, 05:33 PM   #33
skillzman1
Member
 
skillzman1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: saratoga springs, ny
Posts: 233
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stillhunter View Post
Many seasoned hunters mature to the point where they seek the challenge of pursuing older age animals. It should be each hunters personal choice and not mandated by law. This bill is rooted in trophy hunting and control of all hunters to get there.
100% agree.
__________________
Hunt when you can, Fish when you can't.
skillzman1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:32 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

DISCLAIMER: Use of these forums, and information found herein, is at your own risk. Use of this site by members and non-members alike is only granted by the adkhighpeak.com administration provided the terms and conditions found in the FULL DISCLAIMER have been read. Continued use of this site implies that you have read, understood and agree to the terms and conditions of this site. Any questions can be directed to the Administrator of this site.