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Old 12-27-2016, 05:08 PM   #1
Hard Scrabble
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Fur trapping???

It's gotten a whole lot of negative media attention lately.
But it's a challenging art.
Comments??
Jim
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Old 12-27-2016, 09:21 PM   #2
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It certainly is challenging. I've been trapping for over 35 yrs. , when the prices have been high or the prices low I always get out there. Just like your drive to harvest a good buck, or a trophy brookie , I have my drive to trap muskrats,beaver,mink or otter. I like trapping the water animals. I have people call me quite often to trap their property where the beaver are destroying,flooding their woodlots. There will always be negative stories in the media, but there is always going to be negitivity no matter if you are taking fur, deer, bear or fish. But I always try to do it the right way, the most humane way possible , the same way I hunt and fish.
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Old 12-28-2016, 06:36 AM   #3
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Is the negativity centered around the kill?
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Old 12-28-2016, 10:41 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by gmorin71 View Post
Is the negativity centered around the kill?
Among the common concerns:

>Trespassing/failure to ask permission. Setting traps in areas where people or dogs may encounter them without prior knowledge of trapping.
>Setting traps in areas close to public trails and access areas where pets may get trapped
>Trapping dogs, cats accidentally.
>Not attending to trap lines often enough leaving trapping animals to suffer
>Trapped animals ripping or gnawing their legs off to try and escape traps

Last summer I watched a trapped beaver thrashing around in a stream trying to escape from a trap. I was duck hunting from a canoe. When a I returned 5 hours later it was still trying to escape and trying not to drown. As a sportsman who is wired to dispatch game quickly and ethically it was all I could do to resist using my 12 gauge to end it's suffering. It is however illegal to interfere with traps or trapping. In this case the trapper had 24 hours to check the traps....in some zones the time period is up to 48 hours. That's a damned long time to allow an animal to suffer so even though I am an avid hunter and generally endorse trapping....I would never participate in it. I recently decided that I am no longer allowing trapping on my property. I would rather watch the muskrats, beaver and fox than kill them. The coyotes I take care of myself.
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Old 12-28-2016, 05:22 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by mgc View Post
Among the common concerns:

>Trespassing/failure to ask permission. Setting traps in areas where people or dogs may encounter them without prior knowledge of trapping.
>Setting traps in areas close to public trails and access areas where pets may get trapped
>Trapping dogs, cats accidentally.
>Not attending to trap lines often enough leaving trapping animals to suffer
>Trapped animals ripping or gnawing their legs off to try and escape traps

Last summer I watched a trapped beaver thrashing around in a stream trying to escape from a trap. I was duck hunting from a canoe. When a I returned 5 hours later it was still trying to escape and trying not to drown. As a sportsman who is wired to dispatch game quickly and ethically it was all I could do to resist using my 12 gauge to end it's suffering. It is however illegal to interfere with traps or trapping. In this case the trapper had 24 hours to check the traps....in some zones the time period is up to 48 hours. That's a damned long time to allow an animal to suffer so even though I am an avid hunter and generally endorse trapping....I would never participate in it. I recently decided that I am no longer allowing trapping on my property. I would rather watch the muskrats, beaver and fox than kill them. The coyotes I take care of myself.
MGC,
First:
The NY State law requires trappers to to inspect their lines every 24 hours.
Second:
No beaver trapper would set traps in the summer. There is a strongly enforced trapping season. And the fur is not valuable at that time, so why trap them??
It's your choice to agree or disagree, but fur trapping has a long history in the ADK's.
Jim
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Old 12-28-2016, 05:44 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Hard Scrabble View Post
MGC,
First:
The NY State law requires trappers to to inspect their lines every 24 hours.
Second:
No beaver trapper would set traps in the summer. There is a strongly enforced trapping season. And the fur is not valuable at that time, so why trap them??
It's your choice to agree or disagree, but fur trapping has a long history in the ADK's.
Jim
Jim, The question was asked and I listed reasons. You may not like to hear the responses but it is what it is. History has no bearing on why people dislike trapping.

There are zones in NYS where it is legal to check the lines once within 48 hours, not 24 as you note. This is a bit jumbled but you should get the idea. You can check the regs on the DEC site if you wish.
Wildlife Mgmt. Units Trap Type Trap Check Requirements
WMU 5C, 5F, 5G, 5H, 5J, 6F, 6J, and 6N all Visited once in each 48 hour period
WMU 5A, 6A, 6C, 6G, 6H, and 6K Traps set in water during the open season for
beaver, otter, mink & muskrat Visited once in each 48 hour period
WMU 5A, 6A, 6C, 6G, 6H, and 6K Body-gripping traps set on land Visited once in each 48 hour period

Yes, trapping in the summer is not legit and neither is duck hunting. I wrote summer but it must have been the previous fall season. My mistake.

I should also mention that I personally dislike finding skinned carcasses thrown in the water and left to rot. I eat all of the game I hunt except crows. It really irritates me to see the animals meat being wasted. I presume that others are equally bothered by that. This is one reason I am no longer allowing trapping on my property. The other is I decided that I didn't want to worry about where my dogs run when they are with me.
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Old 12-28-2016, 06:30 PM   #7
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I prefer catch and release for my fur
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Old 12-28-2016, 09:58 PM   #8
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I buy my trapping license each year as I sometimes accompany my cousin and his son who trap beaver on my property and that of a friend's where we hunt. But I don't consider myself a trapper. I do consider seasoned trappers such as the ones who keep at it regardless of fur prices to be some of the best woodsmen out there.
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Old 12-28-2016, 10:00 PM   #9
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This topic was bound to cause trouble from the start. It is only serving to create conflict among outdoorsman. Kind of sad when controversial topics continue to get teed up and then left for unproductive conflict.
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Old 12-29-2016, 07:21 AM   #10
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DEC Wildlife Staff will Attend Ballston Spa Fur Auction to Seal Pelts

New York State Department of Environmental Conservation Wildlife staff will be attending a fur auction at Cornell Cooperative Extension 4-H Training Center in Ballston Spa, NY on January 7 to seal bobcat and river otter pelts

Sponsored by the Fulton-Montgomery Fur Harvesters and Foothills Trappers Association, the doors to the auction open at 6:00 a.m. DEC staff will be available at 7:00 a.m., and the auction will begin at 8:00 a.m.

The Cornell Cooperative Extension, 4-H Training Center is located at 556 Middleline Road, Ballston Spa, NY.
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Old 12-29-2016, 12:24 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Stillhunter View Post
This topic was bound to cause trouble from the start. It is only serving to create conflict among outdoorsman. Kind of sad when controversial topics continue to get teed up and then left for unproductive conflict.
When I saw the OP I really had to wonder. Are we observing the stirring up of controversy as a source of stimulation by watching and participating in it as it unfolds? Ie. trolling. I hope not but it sure as heck looks that way.

It only takes one or two bad apples to throw a nicely functioning forum off-course. And it seems to me that the past couple of months have been growing longer than usual on fighting and closed threads while growing shorter on win-win exchanges.
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Old 12-29-2016, 01:21 PM   #12
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My wife took her mothers old mink coat down to Montreal and had it restyled and new lining. Looks great. They don't buy hides as there is huge supply of previously owned coats out there with perfectly fine fur to recycle. A properly treated and stored fur can last 100 years.
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Old 12-29-2016, 02:01 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Stillhunter View Post
This topic was bound to cause trouble from the start. It is only serving to create conflict among outdoorsman. Kind of sad when controversial topics continue to get teed up and then left for unproductive conflict.
Here are some possibilities for other provocative discussions:

*Crossbow during bow season
*Crossbow vs. Long Bow vs. Compound Bow
*Shorter Bow season longer gun season
*Crossbow no longer considered a firearm
*Crossbow requires Bow class and Firearm Hunter Safety course
*Antlerless restrictions to improve large buck population
*Doe for Buck tag requirement
*No harvest of hen turkeys in fall season
*Youth rifle hunt during bow season (as current)
* “Homework” requirement for Hunter Safety courses
*Driving deer
*Using dogs to hunt turkey
*Hunting dogs chasing across private property
*Permit rifle in shotgun only regions (name them)
*Hunting over bait (corn, apples, Swamp Donkey)
*Hunting over planted food plots
*Baiting bear in NYS (or in general)
*Reintroducing wolves in the park
*Introducing elk in the park
*Mandated Safety Orange in firearm seasons
*Pass shooting geese (skybusting) vs. bringing birds in to a spread
*Shooting ducks or geese off of the water or a field vs. in flight
*Nuisance tag hunting to protect crops

I can guarantee that among 10 hunters that there will be at least 10 different opinions about almost any one of these topics. If you read Outdoor News you can see how much very strong dissent is expressed. It's best not to stir the pot because gaining consensus is almost impossible for most of these issues...impossible...and that is within the hunting community. It's a long row to hoe.
A nice thing is that we get to decide how we hunt, for what and with whom presuming that we follow the regs and are ethical in our pursuit of game.
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Old 12-29-2016, 02:05 PM   #14
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You forgot Donald Trump
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Old 12-29-2016, 02:07 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Buckladd View Post
I do consider seasoned trappers such as the ones who keep at it regardless of fur prices to be some of the best woodsmen out there.
There is a great deal of truth in that. A successful legal trapper must possess serious skills to be successful. However I think that we are all aware of some folks that skirt the laws or step outside of the legal bounds. In most cases these folks are well seasoned enough to be able to avoid reproach or detection.
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Old 12-29-2016, 04:11 PM   #16
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Neil and mgc... I really like your latest thoughts on this. As outdoor sporting enthusiasts participating in a single section (hunting & fishing in the Adirondacks) within a broader Adirondack forum we do not help our cause when the topics are negative and argumentative. This section of the forum is at its best when considerate outdoor people who love the Adirondacks report on their outings and experiences and share knowledge about the things we have in common. I can read about a good day on a brook trout pond or tracking a big buck and finally catching a glimpse of him all day long. What leaves a bad taste for everyone is starting an ugly debate that leaves us scratching our heads and not wanting to return.
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Old 12-29-2016, 04:54 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Neil View Post
When I saw the OP I really had to wonder. Are we observing the stirring up of controversy as a source of stimulation by watching and participating in it as it unfolds? Ie. trolling. I hope not but it sure as heck looks that way.

It only takes one or two bad apples to throw a nicely functioning forum off-course. And it seems to me that the past couple of months have been growing longer than usual on fighting and closed threads while growing shorter on win-win exchanges.
Fur trapping has a long history in NY, probably longer than sport fishing or hunting or hiking.
I thought that the subject would bring intelligent (not emotional) comments.
Jim
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Old 12-29-2016, 09:12 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Hard Scrabble View Post
Fur trapping has a long history in NY, probably longer than sport fishing or hunting or hiking.
Agreed. Beaver pelts were one of the first Adirondack exports.
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Old 12-29-2016, 10:40 PM   #19
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Thanks Jim for trying to get a discussion going on this subject. I like trapping ,I like hunting and I like to fish, but most of all I love being out in our Adirondack Mtns. just enjoying everything they have to offer.
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Old 12-29-2016, 11:55 PM   #20
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Trapping is an important part of our outdoor heritage and something I started doing with my Dad and brothers way back when I was in elementary school. I trapped thru high school and community college until I went away to college. Since then I have come back to it for the grounding and basic reality it provides. Still buy my license every season as it helps to manage and conserve animal populations. Jim it is apparent now that you were not trying to just stir the pot but seeking sharing. I am for that but hate to see the anti debate kick in on open for comment invitations. They tend to get hijacked quickly unfortunately.
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