Canoe camping in the southern ADK's

[ceebsonline]

I'm looking for some good southern ADK canoe camping ideas. I've been spoiled by pond hopping and camping up in the St. Regis canoe wilderness several times, but its so far north I can't make it up there much. Just wondering if anyone knows of any good remote spots in the southern half of the ADK's that are difficult to get to without a boat. The more remote and harder to get to the better. I have a lightweight hornbeck so long portages aren't a problem. I'd actually prefer some good long carries so that I could end up on the road (or pond) less traveled. Anyway, any suggestions would be much appreciated.

[Wldrns]

Originally Posted by ceebsonline

I'd actually prefer some good long carries so that I could end up on the road (or pond) less traveled. Anyway, any suggestions would be much appreciated.

Hmmm. I go to those very places, sometimes with, sometimes without a Hornbeck. But if I list them here there is a chance they will not be quite so remote untrampled and less traveled in the near future. You could do what I did to find them. Pour over topo maps, find some interesting looking prospects. Then see if there are any descriptions out there of them, or of nearby areas that could launch you to new destinations. A good place to start is with the Discover the Adirondacks series of books.

Good luck.

[PaulK]

I just read Rumpelstiltskin to my daughter....

King demands a maiden make gold thread from straw. At night Stiltskin shows up, asks for a gift from her and he does the job. Second night, King wants more gold, maiden has a room of straw to turn to gold thread. Stiltskin shows up and asks for another gift, maiden obliges, and he turns the straw to gold thread. Night three, King still needs more gold. Stiltskin shows up in the maidens workroom. She doesn't have anything more to give. Stiltskin says promise me your first born. Done.
King gets his gold, marries the maiden. Stiltskin shows up for the baby. "Oh no! You can't have my baby," says maiden. Stiltskin has a heart. "If you can guess my name in three days, you'll never see me again.
Queen (maiden) has ten knights go out and collect all the names in the land. 9 of ten show up with wrong names when the Queen runs them past Stiltskin. Last knight is out riding in the woods on day three. He sees Stiltskin dancing alone round a fire, running his mouth over and over. "I'm going to win, I'm going to win, my name is Rumpelstiltskin!"
Knight tells Queen. Stiltskin loses. He couldn't keep it to himself.

[EarthBound]

Don't get mad at me, please, but I think this keeping of "lesser known" public places as secrets is absurd and backfires. I came to this forum to learn more about my Adirondacks, it belongs to all of us you know. If I'd read this thread when I first came here I wouldn't have bothered. Trust me, you want more people canoeing, kayaking, mountain biking, camping outside the formal campgrounds....when more people have a vested interest generally more protections are put in place, more areas are set aside as non-motorized. I've seen it in Montana, Washington, Oregon, N.Cali, Michigan...NY benefits from these sports because they have a heavy sidecar of sciences, eco-studies, wildlife studies, and saftey that comes with the nature of these activities producing a more informed public I'd think (even if it is a small part of the population). Baaaa Humbug to your secrets. It's a glass-half-empty approach focussing on the negative. Now that this forum is evidently where we come to brag that "I know something you don't", it becomes less interesting very quickly. Not a nice trend.

[redhawk]

Originally Posted by EarthBound

Don't get mad at me, please, but I think this keeping of "lesser known" public places as secrets is absurd and backfires. I came to this forum to learn more about my Adirondacks, it belongs to all of us you know. If I'd read this thread when I first came here I wouldn't have bothered. Trust me, you want more people canoeing, kayaking, mountain biking, camping outside the formal campgrounds....when more people have a vested interest generally more protections are put in place, more areas are set aside as non-motorized. I've seen it in Montana, Washington, Oregon, N.Cali, Michigan...NY benefits from these sports because they have a heavy sidecar of sciences, eco-studies, wildlife studies, and saftey that comes with the nature of these activities producing a more informed public I'd think (even if it is a small part of the population). Baaaa Humbug to your secrets. It's a glass-half-empty approach focussing on the negative. Now that this forum is evidently where we come to brag that "I know something you don't", it becomes less interesting very quickly. Not a nice trend.

I disagree. I hike in Montana, Wyoming, ND, SD, AZ, NM quite a bit. Always avoiding the places where most people go or know about.

There are plenty of places in the Adirondacks that are well known like the high peaks, etc. I avoid them like the plague because of the number of people who are there and because of the destruction that a few cause. Don't really care about the money or the tourism impact.

I have a feeling that if I ever had the opportunity to ask God why he created the Adirondacks, I'm sure that his answer could not be "To promote tourism".

So, personally I prefer my wilderness to be as close as possible to the way the Creator intended it to be, as opposed to how humans want to eploit it for one reason or another.

[wiiawiwb]

I agree with Earthbound in some respects. People do come here to share ideas and experiences and hopefully, in the process, we all gain from it.

One person asks, "Hey, what is the best knot to lash down my canoe?" and another person says , "Try a truckers knot!". No one has gained at the expense of another even though it may have taken someone years to learn about that knot himself.

Would I feel diminished if I told people on this forum of a honey hole for fishing? Absolutely not. I think those who come here have a very healthy respect for others and for nature itself. I wouldn't feel as though I had to protect it and keep it for myself. Heck, maybe it would even push me to find the next honey hole.

My canoe, while kevlar and light, is too long for real wilderness portage so I never did any remote canoeing with it. I'll ask around and see if I can come with some spots.

[serotonin]

Hi. I need some people to tell me their secret fishing places. Keeping it to yourselves is absurd and backfires. Please include coordinates. I also require a few kind souls to turn my straw into gold. ASAP!

-King

[poconoron]

It is far more enjoyable, I have found, to research these things on your own with TOPO in hand as has been suggested.

It brings with it a sense of discovery and excitement , as opposed to someone telling me where I should go. Try it!

[chaser]

Originally Posted by poconoron

It is far more enjoyable, I have found, to research these things on your own with TOPO in hand as has been suggested.

It brings with it a sense of discovery and excitement , as opposed to someone telling me where I should go. Try it!

I agree

[madison]

Hmmmmm. Ceebsonline, I feel compelled to tell you that usually I have found this forum to be courteous, informative, and helpful. I'm sorry that when you reached out, the response was largely condescension and rudeness.

I fully understand the desire to keep some places that are lesser known and precious to you to oneself. I do that by simply not responding.

Try checking out Cedar River Flow. No carries required and maybe not as remote as you are looking for, but it's a nice paddle and less crowded than a lot of the waters in the Saranac area.

[Wldrns]

Originally Posted by poconoron

It is far more enjoyable, I have found, to research these things on your own with TOPO in hand as has been suggested.

It brings with it a sense of discovery and excitement , as opposed to someone telling me where I should go. Try it!

Exactly. No one is saying you can't go, or that we have installed gates to our favorite remote places so you can't get in. It is just as poconoron said above. You will find it more enjoyable to do the research and to make your own "discoveries". In doing so you will build for yourself the necessary skills to enjoy your own favorite personal spaces.

I can tie down your canoe for you using my own version of a trucker's hitch, but I would rather and would freely and gladly give you the informational skill set for knot tying and the tools for you to securely tie it on your own without depending on me to do it for you. Same with remote places to visit.

Many of us have spent years finding our own individual paths to different places. They are not secrets. Likely with a little research you will find the same path, and in doing so you will learn much about how to make your own paths to many other interesting places.

[DSettahr]

Originally Posted by EarthBound

Trust me, you want more people canoeing, kayaking, mountain biking, camping outside the formal campgrounds....when more people have a vested interest generally more protections are put in place, more areas are set aside as non-motorized.

While I agree to some extent that increased use of backcountry resources will result in an increased interest in protecting those resources, I don't think it's a clear-cut correlation. Increased accessibility does not always equate to increased stewardship- in fact, accessibility by itself without education often leads to a decreased sense of stewardship.

To answer the original question: As I'm sure you're noticing, the southern Adirondacks isn't exactly the mecca of paddling like the northern Adirondacks is. I can't honestly think of anything that would fit your criteria. You could certainly carry a boat back to some place like Pharaoh Lake, or Spruce/Cedar Leaks in the West Canada Lakes, but it's not going to provide you with solitude and/or a plethora of paddling opportunities.

[ceebsonline]

Wow it appears I have spawned quite the debate. I realize that everyone here has spent a lot of time finding there own gems. Quite frankly, I totally understand not wanting to share them. However, I'm not sure the lectures are completely necessary, nor do I appreciate the assumption that I've never glanced at a map. I don't need anyone to tie down my canoe, or to hold my hand and lead me into the woods. I too have spent a lot of time pouring over topo maps, and I have just recently started using the internet as an additional research tool. I found this forum, and it seemed like a place where good people shared the information that they wanted to share, and kept secret the information they wanted to keep secret. I admit, this is my first post to a forum, and I failed to consider that a thousand people could read all of your responses, and overrun your favorite places. I could just have done without the scolding. So thanks to those who made suggestions, sorry to those I offended, and try to relax...

[DSettahr]

Originally Posted by ceebsonline

I admit, this is my first post to a forum

Even the most contentious "discussions" on this forum are very, very tame compared to what most internet message boards are like.

One of the reasons I enjoy posting here- people aren't afraid to share their thoughts, but they are generally very respectful about how they do it.

[EarthBound]

Originally Posted by DSettahr

Even the most contentious "discussions" on this forum are very, very tame compared to what most internet message boards are like.

One of the reasons I enjoy posting here- people aren't afraid to share their thoughts, but they are generally very respectful about how they do it.

[richard p]

I don't have any secret places to share(but I would if I had), but have you read Quiet Water Canoe Guide? Great info on most of New York state. Not everyone has the abiity or time to study topo maps, go exploring and bushwack their way to a remote location. Back in the early 80's I was a cubicle rat in NYC and wanted a cheap, yet enjoyable vacation. Looking at the guide books of the time I discovered Indian Lake campground and eventually discovered the SRCA, Lila, Lowes, Oswegatchie, etc, etc. and a few lesser traveled areas Without guide books and advise from forums like this I would never have discovered these places. Nor would I have the respect for human powered craft. I am part of the hoards that decend upon the Adirondacks in the summer but I go out of my way to support local buisnesses for food, equipment and anything else I need. I go out of my way to encourage friends and co workers to enjoy this magical place instead of taking the family to Disney or the larger lakes to go jet sking. I donate money on my tax return to support the area too. I think there are mant people like me out there and sure, there are the clods with that play load music, litter, and definitly do not leave the place better than they found it, but they are not the majority - not even in the public campgrounds. If I could vote in NY you bet I would vote for more money to buy land and support what we have. So, I think sharing is good and the more people who visit, the more people who will support maintaining and expanding it. Just my .02

[teclo]

Originally Posted by madison

I fully understand the desire to keep some places that are lesser known and precious to you to oneself. I do that by simply not responding.

This seems a pretty obvious and simple path to politetown.

I too am sorry that I'm sorry that when you reached out, the response was largely condescension and rudeness.

I don't really understand the ego at play for someone to suggest that you find a secret remote spot by buying a book anyway, but ok.

It might not be very remote, but with all of the easier access boat launch type campsites available in the region, the independence river area ponds seem all far less travelled than the others. I don't portage a lot though because I have heavy boats. Sorry I can't be of more help.

[ALGonquin Bob]

I'm with Earthbound on this; it's simply selfish to withhold info from a paddler who cares enough to ask about special places, especially if someone takes the time to reply to just say they don't want to "reveal" those remote paddle destinations. If you don't care to help answer the question, then why bother replying? Personally, I drive up from Buffalo, and it doesn't much matter to me if I drive 4 hours or 5 to get to a put-in. All of my Adirondack paddling is in the popular lake country or more remote areas such as the Oswegatchie, and I've never seen it "too crowded".
I view the popular more northern paddle destinations as the best places to paddle, and that's why they're popular, of course. For southern Adirondack paddling destinations, check out this website:
http://www.gobacktothebasics.com/can...ndack_park.htm

[poconoron]

IMHO some people are wound-up way too tight here. Some of us were merely suggesting that it is more rewarding to take TOPO in hand and do some exploring in preparation for their upcoming southern ADK trip.

The sensitivity of some here is way off the charts.

[rollinslover64]

I have to agree with Poconoron on this one.I love doing the research myself but if I cannot find what I'm looking for I have no problem asking.I know one member here that has seen alot more of the Adirondacks than I have and if in the future I have a question I'll probably PM him first but I'm certainly not afraid to ask and take the abuse I'm sure to get.If I had suggestions for you Ceebsonline I'd give it to you either with a post or a PM but I don't know of much in the Southern part unless you care to bushwhack about 6 miles to get there.Let me know if that is an option but I doubt it would be.