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Old 05-24-2017, 04:42 PM   #1
Nairb
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Fall stream or cedar river flow?

Hello everyone. I'm planning on taking a weekend trip next weekend June 2nd through the fourth. Trying to decide between paddling/camping on vly lake via fall stream or cedar river flow. I haven't been to either places. Any opinions, tips, or alternative ideas would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance for any input.
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Old 05-24-2017, 06:48 PM   #2
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i have not confirmed but heard there is a new quarry in Piseco area with noise heard on Fall Stream. Maybe someone else can confirm.
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Old 05-24-2017, 06:57 PM   #3
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I paddled Fall stream a few years ago with intention of getting to Vly, but after about the tenth beaver dam was satisfied to make it to Fall Lake. Had no regrets of being there, it just took considerably longer than I expected.
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Old 05-24-2017, 07:30 PM   #4
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Getting to the Vly is not bad in the spring, I'd guess June 2nd would be OK. Last time I paddled I think I had to get out over two, maybe 3 beaver dams.

Can't speak to the quarry noise, but I know there are a few in the area. Perhaps the one that can be heard is the one over near Fawn lake? Can't imagine it would be an issue at night...

WTBS, I heard nothing but the wind out on the Vly.

Camping prospects aren't great for tents. Ground is pretty steep sided on the east side of the vly, and it's swampy elsewhere. I didn't inspect fully, but this is what I recall.

It's a nice paddle though. CRF will definitely have more options for campsites, but I'd expect some fellow campers. Doubt you'll encounter anyone up fall stream.
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Old 05-24-2017, 07:40 PM   #5
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I have not camped at either, but have paddled both and checked out the campsites. IMO, Cedar River flow would be a better option for camping, as there are a number of decent campsites. Vly itself only has 2 campsites, both of which are difficult access and located on a hillside. There is a decent campsite along Fall Stream a short distance before reaching Vly, which I would say is your only viable option for camping.
When we paddled Fall Stream last August, we only had to lift over a few beaver dams. With the current high water levels, I doubt you would encounter any issues with beaver dams.
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Old 05-24-2017, 07:42 PM   #6
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Fall Stream has a lengthy (in terms of time) approach to the few camping spots.
CRF has many more campsites, but small motors are allowed on CRF. I don't know the hp limit, but I've never seen much more than a little kicker on a V hull rowboat.
Also, if you go to CRF, I would avoid the sites nearest the dam...the drive in sites tend to attract a more rowdy and noisy sort of camper. There are a couple nice sites up on the river itself, including a lean to.

Alternatives could be a carry to Cedar Lakes, but that may be more effort (approx 5 miles) than you want to expend.
Closer to Fall Stream would be a trip from Good Luck Lake to Spectacle Lake, this one requires a carry of about 1.5 miles, but you are just about assured of solitude...
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Old 05-24-2017, 08:55 PM   #7
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Having done both I think Vly is more work, but more remote feeling.
http://www.jimmuller.com/canoe-trips/fall-stream/
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Old 05-24-2017, 08:56 PM   #8
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Both are worthy but I would go with CRF.
1. It will be less busy this time of year than in mid-summer.
2. It has loons, Vly does not.
3. Better chance of getting a breezy campsite in black fly season.
4. You can go to Vly (& beyond) later in the season & still be alone - I've been the only one camped there on July 4.

I've seen motors on both.
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Old 05-24-2017, 09:48 PM   #9
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Thanks to everyone for the info. Does anybody happen know what the current is like this time of year in fall stream with the water level being so high? Also how bad are the black flies this year? This will be the first trip up there for me this year.
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Old 05-24-2017, 09:52 PM   #10
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The current is not an issue IMO. Fall stream is pretty slow flowing.

BF will likely be a pain, but a stiff breeze may help. It was windy on both Fall lake and the Vly last time I went. Who knows how common that is?

I've never camped out at the Vly sites, but like I said, didn't look so good for a tent. I'd bring my hammock.
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Old 05-25-2017, 09:24 AM   #11
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Re: Fall Stream

I paddled Fall Stream this past Apr/May weekend. The water was high, but not an impediment to easy paddling. At the put-in carry upstream past the launch site about a hundred yards and access the river above the beaver dam. The Vly Lake campsites are awkward in every way. Awkward takeout- You can barely get your canoe out of the water for the night. It's also awkward climbing up to the site itself. There's space for one tent but the space slopes awkwardly If you're hammock camping and your hammock requires a longer than average tree spacing, you'll be searching up the hill a little further. My paddling partner found two trees spaced adequately for his Hennessey but I had to hunt around. That said the site is pretty enough. Fall Stream is especially pretty between the two lakes.
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Old 05-26-2017, 07:54 AM   #12
Nairb
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Thanks to everyone for the info. Still kinda torn as to where to go. I don't think I'll be able to make it up there until early evening so maybe crf would be a better choice.
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Old 05-26-2017, 08:47 AM   #13
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CRF has been party central for the last couple of years. If you get unlucky, it can be quite noisy.
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Old 05-26-2017, 09:52 AM   #14
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Is it quiet further out away from the parking area at crf or are is the whole place a party spot now?
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Old 05-26-2017, 10:27 AM   #15
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personally i'd take CRF any day over Fall Stream, better scenery and a lot more choices for camping. at the dam can be pretty noisy, but above the dam, on the east side, are a few campsites well protected from what ever is going at the dam..
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Old 05-26-2017, 01:57 PM   #16
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I've spent weekend nights at CRF 4 or 5 times in the last three years, mostly in July and August, and in the middle area of the flow. The only rowdy campers I heard there were boyscouts one night and even that was over with by dark.

The flow has a 10hp restriction, which combined with the unimproved boat launch, definitely limits the motor boaters.
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Old 05-26-2017, 02:59 PM   #17
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For what it's worth, my wife and i paddled up to Vly Lake two summers ago in July. When we made it up there we found a motor boat and people water skiing. Any hope we'd had of a quiet day was essentially gone. As for the "campsites" there, I'd second the recommendation for using a hammock. I'm not sure you'll find any spot worthy for a tent; even a small one.

That's all for now. Take care and until next time...be well.

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Old 05-26-2017, 03:03 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nairb View Post
Is it quiet further out away from the parking area at crf or are is the whole place a party spot now?
It depends. Usually around the dam it's mostly just radios, generators and chainsaws. It's sort of our go-to place for quick canoe camping in the late summer and fall, and it's easy to get far enough away from the dam to avoid that noise. But like I said, it can go either way if you get a party at one of the other sites out on the lake. I heard they are working on the ranger cabin there so I'm hoping that might mean a ranger presence like they had quite a few years ago. Sometimes it's very quiet and quite pretty. There's a couple sites way down on the end near the inlet that are remote enough that even if there is a party, it might not bug you. Depends on your tolerance. Last year I was there maybe 6 times and twice I wished I stayed home because of all the jackassery going on.

Last edited by JohnnyVirgil; 05-26-2017 at 06:48 PM..
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Old 05-26-2017, 03:37 PM   #19
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Yeah, most of the boorish camper behavior at the CRF has been right at the dam, and the rangers have been trying to crack down on it. As mentioned above, the DEC has been investing in fixing up one of the old gate cabins. Hoping they will have an overnight presence there, at least on peak weekends.
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Old 05-26-2017, 05:30 PM   #20
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I wrote a trip report last summer about the ridiculous party crowd on the Flow last summer. I don't know if I kept running into the same two idiots or it's a trend but two canoes tied to a pallet and outboard were host to two screaming morons on the Flow and 13th Lake. I asume the quietest time to go to the Flow is peak black fly time while the barge morons are landlocked.

Choosing between locations might be based on how much you want to explore when there. The Flow offers more.
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