Adirondack Forum  
Rules Membership Donations and Online Store Adkhighpeaks Foundation ADKhighpeaks Forums ADKhighpeaks Wiki Disclaimer

Go Back   Adirondack Forum > The Adirondack Forum > Hunting and Fishing in the Adirondacks
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 10-07-2019, 08:59 PM   #1
Green Drake
Member
 
Green Drake's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 40
Lake Colden Brook Trout DEC Press Release

FYI

https://www.dec.ny.gov/press/118397.html
Green Drake is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2019, 09:25 PM   #2
DSettahr
ɹǝqɯǝɯ
 
DSettahr's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 4,717
Just in time for this wonderful news: https://www.adirondackcouncil.org/pa...acks-1247.html
DSettahr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2019, 09:30 PM   #3
wildbrookies
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,457
__________________
"Get your mind off trout,if you can.I know they`ve got you.I can see it. Every fraternity of sufferers knows its brothers.Trout hook men;men don`t hook trout.Better try and throw the hook while you can.By the time you`re a grown man there probably won`t be a pure trout healthy enough to fiddle with"... Quote from Emerson in the book "The Earth Is Enough"by Harry Middleton
wildbrookies is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2019, 10:13 PM   #4
dundee
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,633
I read an article (can't remember exactly, but may have been a DEC written history) about Avalanche Lake and Lake Colden. The article said that they were probably fishless. the rookies they now finding may be descendants of fish stocked by the Tahwaus Club who owned the property up to the 1920's.
dundee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2019, 10:58 PM   #5
Green Drake
Member
 
Green Drake's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 40
The DEC also did aerial stocking of Colden until 1977 and Avalanche until 1986, but by that point both lakes were so acidic the fish probably weren't lasting the season.
Green Drake is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2019, 06:42 AM   #6
Tug Hill
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Green Drake View Post
The DEC also did aerial stocking of Colden until 1977 and Avalanche until 1986, but by that point both lakes were so acidic the fish probably weren't lasting the season.
According to the article , apparently they were lasting. There’s a lake in the moose river plains that so called, experts , always stated could not support brook trout.
But, funny thing, there are brook trout in it ?
Tug Hill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2019, 10:15 AM   #7
Lucky13
Member
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 496
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSettahr View Post
Just in time for this wonderful news: https://www.adirondackcouncil.org/pa...acks-1247.html
I want to point out that our wonderful empero...I mean, Governor seems to be taking an inordinate amount of credit, through his mouthpiece Basil Segos, for actions that NYS took after the fact of the initiation of the Clean Air Act at the Federal Level, and if it was the NYS actions that resulted in this change at Colden, the changes in the midwest may be moot (not my feeling at all). However a look at the graph that Mr Janeway is using to tar Trump shows larger "shifts in trend" in 2010-11, and many shifts throughout the data series. Also, two years is insufficient to define any trend or shift in one. These shifts could just be measurement "noise", we don't see the error bars on these points so have no way of judging. And the over all trend in that data is still a rise in pH and a drop in Conductivity. But maybe our NYS Attorney General can find some time between suing for Trump's tax returns to sue the midwest states where the soot originates, and the EPA, for these " externalities."

Bravo to the ALSC for taking the time to look. Their database has been a great source of information for me ever since I found out about it. Here's a link for any who have not visited the site. http://www.adirondacklakessurvey.org/

For a great description of Colden when it was full of trout, read Vincent Engels' "Adirondack Fishing in the 1930's; A Lost Paradise." I want to cry for what I missed and we lost every time I revisit the book.
Lucky13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2019, 01:39 PM   #8
Stillhunter
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 392
Well said Lucky13.
Stillhunter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2019, 01:55 PM   #9
webby459
Member
 
webby459's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 193
Lucky, I'm trying to understand parts of your post. You put quotes around externalities, implying (?) that you are skeptical of midwest particulates as a cause of acid rain and general pollution. But prior to that you say (moot).

If it were particulate pollution, partially from the midwest which I think follows from the direction of the prevailing wind, and those particulates specifically from coal plants partially or fully caused acid rain, then wouldn't increasing those outputs be kind of a defacto bad thing?

Without even considering the political element or lawsuits, at least and especially from our perspective, ostensibly NYers, wouldn't leaving the regs for coal plant outputs alone have been more beneficial?

Otherwise, I'm thrilled with species having more health in our lakes. I hope the trend continues!
webby459 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2019, 02:03 PM   #10
OntarioSkiBum
Member
 
OntarioSkiBum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 315
Ontario eliminated coal based generation about 5 years back. I would think that would have as much (or more) of a beneficial impact on the Adirondacks then the Midwest.
OntarioSkiBum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2019, 03:42 PM   #11
Lucky13
Member
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 496
Quote:
Originally Posted by webby459 View Post
Lucky, I'm trying to understand parts of your post. You put quotes around externalities, implying (?) that you are skeptical of midwest particulates as a cause of acid rain and general pollution. But prior to that you say (moot).

If it were particulate pollution, partially from the midwest which I think follows from the direction of the prevailing wind, and those particulates specifically from coal plants partially or fully caused acid rain, then wouldn't increasing those outputs be kind of a defacto bad thing?

Without even considering the political element or lawsuits, at least and especially from our perspective, ostensibly NYers, wouldn't leaving the regs for coal plant outputs alone have been more beneficial?

Otherwise, I'm thrilled with species having more health in our lakes. I hope the trend continues!
I think I put then quotes around the word because for many it might be jargon, but I would definitely support litigation to make it cease, and it is likely that we'll see some slowdown of recovery. But environmental change doesn't usually happen rapidly, so some of the cause and effect drawn here (or that's what I'm hearing) may be a little premature.
Lucky13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2019, 03:47 PM   #12
webby459
Member
 
webby459's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 193
I got it, thanks for taking the time Lucky.
webby459 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2019, 06:38 PM   #13
ILikeRocks
Member
 
ILikeRocks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Rome, NY
Posts: 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by OntarioSkiBum View Post
Ontario eliminated coal based generation about 5 years back. I would think that would have as much (or more) of a beneficial impact on the Adirondacks then the Midwest.
The prevailing winds for the NE United States come from the SW (Midwest USA), that makes the Midwest “upstream” of us. Their air pollution goes to us.
ILikeRocks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2019, 04:47 PM   #14
OntarioSkiBum
Member
 
OntarioSkiBum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 315
Quote:
Originally Posted by ILikeRocks View Post
The prevailing winds for the NE United States come from the SW (Midwest USA), that makes the Midwest “upstream” of us. Their air pollution goes to us.
This is from the NOAA... The prevailing wind is generally from the west in New York State. A southwest component
becomes evident in winds during the warmer months while a northwest component is
characteristic of the colder half of the year.

I would say the transformation of the rust belt from manufacturing to service based economies has also played a huge role.
OntarioSkiBum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2019, 05:54 PM   #15
geogymn
Member
 
geogymn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,971
Wind site:

https://www.ventusky.com/?p=40.9;-87.8;4&l=wind-10m
__________________
"A culture is no better than its woods." W.H. Auden
geogymn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2019, 08:40 PM   #16
Stillhunter
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 392
Over the next 5 to 10 years this press release will bring high and steady fishing pressure just like a few other recent recovered waters have been hit hard. The spawning brookies will probably be impacted more by "catch and eat" than any increase in acid precipitation.
Stillhunter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2019, 09:37 AM   #17
Lucky13
Member
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 496
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stillhunter View Post
Over the next 5 to 10 years this press release will bring high and steady fishing pressure just like a few other recent recovered waters have been hit hard. The spawning brookies will probably be impacted more by "catch and eat" than any increase in acid precipitation.
I think the remoteness and distance will mitigate some of that. And old timer's like me won't get in there because we sleep too late to get a parking space anymore!
Lucky13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2019, 09:28 PM   #18
TCD
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,782
I read the article about this in the Sun Community News today.

DEC maintains that there were "NO FISH" in Lake Colden in 2004. Well how do they know? Did they pump the lake dry, and filter all the water through a screen? Of course not.

Now, according to the article, they are struggling to explain how the fish have mysteriously reappeared. Occam's razor says the simplest explanation is the they have been there all along, just not detected. But that doesn't fit the heroic political narrative that Seggos is trying to spray.

Not a fisherman; just annoyed by the narrative spray that seems to be DEC's strongest product these days...
TCD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2019, 07:41 AM   #19
Adironzach
Member
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by TCD View Post
I read the article about this in the Sun Community News today.

DEC maintains that there were "NO FISH" in Lake Colden in 2004. Well how do they know? Did they pump the lake dry, and filter all the water through a screen? Of course not.

Now, according to the article, they are struggling to explain how the fish have mysteriously reappeared. Occam's razor says the simplest explanation is the they have been there all along, just not detected. But that doesn't fit the heroic political narrative that Seggos is trying to spray.

Not a fisherman; just annoyed by the narrative spray that seems to be DEC's strongest product these days...
I do not know what survey techniques they used for the study so i wont comment on that. Personally though, i spent a lot of time in the Lake Colden region from 05-09 and the lake was always devoid of life. Small baitfish, crayfish, salamanders, nothing. I always found it eerily empty.
Adironzach is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2019, 04:10 PM   #20
vtflyfish
Brookie Addict
 
vtflyfish's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: West coast of New England
Posts: 2,524
Quote:
Originally Posted by TCD View Post
I read the article about this in the Sun Community News today.

DEC maintains that there were "NO FISH" in Lake Colden in 2004. Well how do they know?
Not a fisherman; just annoyed by the narrative spray that seems to be DEC's strongest product these days...
TCD, this isn't the first lake to spontaneously regenerate. Honnedaga is the classic example. The prevailing hypothesis is that brookies persisted in small numbers in tributary streams. They then colonized the lakes when conditions improved to the point they could reliably live there. Proof positive? No, but a reasonable scenario backed up by ALSC netting and survey data.

I'm not a big fan of their narrative but before you totally trash the DEC please be aware of the following:
  • The DEC successfully reclaimed numerous water bodies for brook trout that were severely degraded by invasive species. Entire watersheds were recovered in some cases.
The DEC identified, saved and re-stocked several brook trout strains that are unique to the Adirondacks.[/LIST]As a result it is now possible to catch a 6 lb brookie in the Adirondacks. ask me how I know. That possibility hasn't existed in many, many decades.
__________________
Oscar Wilde:Work is the curse of the drinking class
vtflyfish is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:13 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

DISCLAIMER: Use of these forums, and information found herein, is at your own risk. Use of this site by members and non-members alike is only granted by the adkhighpeak.com administration provided the terms and conditions found in the FULL DISCLAIMER have been read. Continued use of this site implies that you have read, understood and agree to the terms and conditions of this site. Any questions can be directed to the Administrator of this site.