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Old 12-21-2010, 09:10 PM   #1
Guideboatrower
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Reenforcing cane seat (for guide boat)?

Hi from Denmark,

I have a kevlar guide boat that isn't even a year old, and the cane seat is already beggining to sag a bit when it becomes wet and/or warm - most often I even use my sliding seat.

So I'm thinking of reenforcing it with glass fibre from the bottom.

But which cloth weight should I use? is 135g cloth strong enough? Is 160g cloth not transparent enough?

And how do I go about it? Do I flip the seat over, clean the seat with spirits, lay the cloth and saturate it with epoxy, or do I have to dissassemble the seat entirely to do this?
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Old 12-22-2010, 06:42 AM   #2
JJW
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Hello,
Sad to hear that you are having issues with the seat cane sagging.

My first thought would be just re-cane the seat with high quality cane and cane it to higher tension.

I'm not sold on fiberglassing it.

If you can post pictures, a photograph might help.

Good Luck,
John
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Old 12-22-2010, 07:04 AM   #3
Guideboatrower
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I'm pretty sure it's one of those with ready-made cane webbing-things.

I don't have a close up picture of my own, but I guess I could take one, but it's this seat (only on one of their kevlar versions):



My seat, when it's all dry/cold after a day or so, it's tight again, but five minutes in the saddle, and we're sagging again.

This is my boat this past (early) summer, and it's the best picture I have of the seat:


Even in the picture from early summer, you can see a little sagging if you look close enough
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Old 12-22-2010, 08:56 AM   #4
fisher39
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Yeah, as JJW said, I definitely wouldn't do a reinforcement... such jury rigging should only be used on less beautiful watercraft! I'd get it re-caned.

Did you buy it new from the boat builder? If so, if you haven't contacted them already, I'd let them know. My guess is that re-caning the seat is a relatively minor cost.

As a temporary measure, you might want to consider one of those very comfortable foam canoe seats, which is essentially the same design but much more utilitarian.
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Old 12-22-2010, 10:12 AM   #5
Wldrns
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Chances are your seat may have been manufactured at Essex Industries, located right here in the Adirondacks. Or maybe not if it is failing already, as EI turns out a good product. You might try writing to them.
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Old 12-22-2010, 12:22 PM   #6
stripperguy
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Mr. Rower,

I have built a few sheet caned seats, always with disappointing results. The cane, if it does not stretch excessively, with almost surely crack along the edge of the wooden frame where the caning deflection is greatest.
I have abandoned using sheet cane long ago. For a pretty boat such as yours, I have used synthetic snow show lacing, and woven it through holes drilled in the seat frame. You might want to use your existing seat frame as a pattern, and make another seat frame that would be laced with the neoprene snow shoe lacing. I have a couple of boats that I built over 25 years ago, and these seats and their lacing have survived quite well.
Not as pretty, but just as effective, I have also laced seat frames with braided nylon rope, around 3/16 inch diameter works well. These nylon cord laced seats are comfortable, do not sag, and do not degrade through the years. I have another couple of boats that I built about 15 years ago, again, these seats are surviving quite well.

Quite often, those pretty features such as caned seats, leather straps and brass plaques look nice on a boat, but are not really practical for a boat that will be used frequently.
Keep us posted on your decision...
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Old 12-22-2010, 02:08 PM   #7
Guideboatrower
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Thanks, everyone

@Fisher39 and Wldrns,

I haven't contacted Adirondack Guide Boats on this issue, because we had so much trouble with the shipping company that I feel I know Randy personally, and I have asked a lot of other questions (not problems, mind you, but about the RAL code (it's a colour code), if it was possible to remove front and/or rear seat without cracking the boat in waves, how to make a "proper" foot brace, not counting the many, many questions before buying something like this sight unseen, and on and on), so I'm beginning to feel like one of those really annoying people.


But I might contact them and simply ask if it's essex industries making their seats, because with their prices, it might even be a lot cheaper to simply order a new seat from Essex regardless if they made the original, rather than having my seat be sent back and forth across the Atlantic.

@Stripperguy

I like the idea of artifical snow shoe lacing, but I'm hypersensitive to a lot of things, and one of the worst is neoprene (but even tags in clothing, cheap plastic zippers, you name it).
I like the idea of simply drilling holes and do "something else",, and the nylon cord idea might actually be viable. I can get hold of some nice modern non-stretch string that looks old school (colour like hemp rope) but I'm betting it would take me the better part of week to restring something like that, unless I did it as a simple grid.

I'm very glad for all your excellent suggestions. I'll try to contact Essex Industries first, and then go from there.

Actually, having looked at their seats, I really like the curved cane seats so I could sit even lower, although I think that may be quickly become too low. It looks awesome, though!
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