Adirondack Forum  
Rules Membership Donations and Online Store Adkhighpeaks Foundation ADKhighpeaks Forums ADKhighpeaks Wiki Disclaimer

Go Back   Adirondack Forum > General Forum Related Topics > "By the Fireside"
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

View Poll Results: Do you ever burn waste in a campfire?
No, never! 27 30.68%
Yeah, if I can incinerate it to nonexistence! 61 69.32%
Voters: 88. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 03-17-2016, 12:46 PM   #81
DSettahr
ɹǝqɯǝɯ
 
DSettahr's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 4,372
Yes, I am very familiar with the amount of "stuff" that tends to end up at Pharaoh Lake.

I encountered a group that hauled an ice chest on a cart to Pharaoh Lake once. They indicated that it weighed about 200 pounds, filled with ice and venison (and probably a fair amount of beer). I'm sure they exaggerated on the weight a little bit, but if you took one look at the chest, it was pretty obvious that it wasn't light. To their credit, the site was absolutely spotless when they left. I'm pretty sure they even carried out a bunch of garbage that wasn't theirs.
DSettahr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2016, 01:58 PM   #82
mike
Member
 
mike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Syracuse, NY
Posts: 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSettahr View Post
Yes, I am very familiar with the amount of "stuff" that tends to end up at Pharaoh Lake.

I encountered a group that hauled an ice chest on a cart to Pharaoh Lake once. They indicated that it weighed about 200 pounds, filled with ice and venison (and probably a fair amount of beer). I'm sure they exaggerated on the weight a little bit, but if you took one look at the chest, it was pretty obvious that it wasn't light. To their credit, the site was absolutely spotless when they left. I'm pretty sure they even carried out a bunch of garbage that wasn't theirs.

200lbs would probably only be a slight exaggeration. Some of those large coolers can hold well over 100 cans of bear, and weigh 20lbs empty.

If it was a 100quart+ cooler, its not hard to imagine it being 120-200lbs, depending how full it was.

I've digressed a bit, but its fun to talk about how crazy people are.
__________________
mike
mike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2016, 02:21 PM   #83
Anonymous
Member
 
Anonymous's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Schenectady NY
Posts: 16
Interesting post. Burning garbage aside, I'm actually surprised by the number of members that don't have fires.

For me, sitting by the fire as the sun sets after a great day of hiking or paddling is a huge part of the experience. Im not sure I could give that up.
__________________
"A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages."
-Tennessee Williams
Anonymous is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2016, 02:56 PM   #84
DSettahr
ɹǝqɯǝɯ
 
DSettahr's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 4,372
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anonymous View Post
Interesting post. Burning garbage aside, I'm actually surprised by the number of members that don't have fires.

For me, sitting by the fire as the sun sets after a great day of hiking or paddling is a huge part of the experience. I'm not sure I could give that up.
IMO, you don't need to give up fires entirely to make a positive difference. At least occasionally choosing not to have them would make a huge difference, I think, if everyone did it. For example, if you get into a campsite late on a Friday night and are heading to bed soon anyways, don't have a fire on that night. And when you do have a fire, do what you can to limit the size and/or duration of it, as appropriate for the site and how much use the area gets.
DSettahr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2016, 09:27 PM   #85
Justin
Moving along
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 5,677
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anonymous View Post
Interesting post. Burning garbage aside, I'm actually surprised by the number of members that don't have fires.
And to think that the results of this "interesting" poll are still more than half!
Justin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2016, 07:56 AM   #86
MrKawfey
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
And to think that the results of this "interesting" poll are still more than half!
I think it may be a bit misleading. I voted for the "if you can incinerate" option, but that, for me essentially means paper product only. That's a lot different than someone who votes the same way but throws leftovers in the fire along with the plastic wrapper the food was packed in.

Despite the wording of the poll I think it's great that this thread keeps bubbling to the top because is a discussion worth having.
MrKawfey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2016, 07:20 PM   #87
Justin
Moving along
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 5,677
Ok, Montcalm was right, I am a hypocrite!
I was out camping with an Adkforum member (who doesn't post much anymore), and I got busted blowing my nose into toilet paper and then disposing in the campfire, and it was "very gooey"!
So it appears that I should've voted yes to this poll instead of no... I guess I do burn my gooey trash instead of carrying it out.
Justin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2016, 08:19 AM   #88
geogymn
Member
 
geogymn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,773
The path to redemption leads to the highest (in)sights.
__________________
"A culture is no better than its woods." W.H. Auden
geogymn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2016, 12:26 PM   #89
John H Swanson
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 145
All Plastics is not the same

PET (soda bottles) when burned break down into only water vapor, oxygen, and carbon (soot) It is quite friendly to burn. You will need to make sure it has no label or label glue or tamper evident cap ring ....if you are looking for a LNT burn

PVC, by comparison, when burned at a low temperature, such as on a campfire, gives off dioxin which is carcinogenic. That would be "leave big trace"

In the old days, some water bottles were PVC, but now most are PET. The code on the bottom tells you the composition.

So, if you choose to burn plastic, it is important to bring the right plastic.

btw, most paper food wrappers (like oatmeal pouches) are lined with plastic to make them heat sealable. So don't think you're burning only paper when you're not. This plastic is PE.

I answered yes to burning but often don't make a fire at all. And burning a Poland Spring 8oz water bottle to avoid carrying the weight out of the woods is comical logic.

Some times I burn a candle and that comes from crude oil and gives off pollution too! I might switch to beeswax or a canola oil lamp.
John H Swanson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2016, 11:52 PM   #90
All Downhill From Here
Longstrider
 
All Downhill From Here's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 207
"Minimize Campfire Impacts" and "Dispose of Waste Properly" are 2 of my rules.

Burning trash is a leftover sentiment from when you had to burn the tin off your cans so that they'd rust in the can dump behind the shelter.
All Downhill From Here is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2016, 10:22 AM   #91
mike
Member
 
mike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Syracuse, NY
Posts: 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by John H Swanson View Post
PET (soda bottles) when burned break down into only water vapor, oxygen, and carbon (soot) It is quite friendly to burn. You will need to make sure it has no label or label glue or tamper evident cap ring ....if you are looking for a LNT burn

PET is used to make polyester and a few other materials, its not a super clean process, but its still pretty awesome.

PET is fairly LNT all around to be honest.

So if you're wearing a polyester fleece, you are basically wearing a bunch of soda bottles.
__________________
mike
mike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2016, 12:18 PM   #92
MrKawfey
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 144
I suppose I'd like to ask about food. Generally, I don't throw food in the fire, but there's always an occasional spill from a pot or a dropped piece that gets tossed in. If food items are "completely" burned, wouldn't you just be left with carbon? What's so different between a stick and a stick of celery, for example?

Obviously unburned food left behind is an issue, but are there some foods that are harmful even in a completely burned state?

I'm curious to know, depending on the answer it would be pretty easy to switch jobs and just let my wife do the cooking, then everything would be completely burned for sure.
MrKawfey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2016, 08:47 PM   #93
DSettahr
ɹǝqɯǝɯ
 
DSettahr's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 4,372
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrKawfey View Post
I suppose I'd like to ask about food. Generally, I don't throw food in the fire, but there's always an occasional spill from a pot or a dropped piece that gets tossed in. If food items are "completely" burned, wouldn't you just be left with carbon? What's so different between a stick and a stick of celery, for example?

Obviously unburned food left behind is an issue, but are there some foods that are harmful even in a completely burned state?

I'm curious to know, depending on the answer it would be pretty easy to switch jobs and just let my wife do the cooking, then everything would be completely burned for sure.
I can think of a few potential issues with burning food. For one, throwing food into the fire can cause the scent of the food to spread over a much wider area as it burns, which carries with it the potential for attracting wildlife to the site.

The second issue is that a lot of people who burn food fail to ensure that it is fully consumed by the fire, so once the site is vacated, you've got food scraps left behind in the fire pit. Again, this can lead to problems with negative human-wildlife encounters.

It's also worth nothing that the DEC regulations are pretty clear that only dead and downed wood may be burned. It is a violation to burn any garbage, even paper.
DSettahr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2016, 08:53 PM   #94
montcalm
Mobster
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 734
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
Ok, Montcalm was right, I am a hypocrite!
I was out camping with an Adkforum member (who doesn't post much anymore), and I got busted blowing my nose into toilet paper and then disposing in the campfire, and it was "very gooey"!
So it appears that I should've voted yes to this poll instead of no... I guess I do burn my gooey trash instead of carrying it out.
We all do it, and it's harmless. I forgive you, although the DEC may not be as understanding as I am.

I actually put my gooey nose papers in my pocket and let them dry out for the next trip. Makes for excellent tinder

FWIW I am the guy who says something when I'm with people who throw food or plastic or bottles or cans in the fire. I'll make them pick it out. It's not an argument I ever lose.
montcalm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2016, 10:59 AM   #95
dmartenvt
Member
 
dmartenvt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Northern VT and Northern ADK
Posts: 343
My guess (as an environmental chemist) is that burning PET plastic at regular campfire temps has the potential of creating PAH's (polyaromatic hydrocarbons) and aldehydes, which isn't nice to breathe can be toxic to wildlife and humans. The absence of chlorine in the structure does prevent the nasty dioxins, but I still would pack the PET plastic out.
dmartenvt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2016, 12:39 PM   #96
vtflyfish
Brookie Addict
 
vtflyfish's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: West coast of New England
Posts: 2,310
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmartenvt View Post
My guess (as an environmental chemist) is that burning PET plastic at regular campfire temps has the potential of creating PAH's (polyaromatic hydrocarbons) and aldehydes, which isn't nice to breathe can be toxic to wildlife and humans. The absence of chlorine in the structure does prevent the nasty dioxins, but I still would pack the PET plastic out.
Very interesting! So from a chemists perspective are any commonly used packaging materials safe to burn at campfire temperatures? Your answer will either kill off or infinitely extend this debate.
__________________
Oscar Wilde:Work is the curse of the drinking class
vtflyfish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2016, 12:46 PM   #97
Zach
Last seen wandering vaguely
 
Zach's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Orwell NY
Posts: 718
Outdoor burning of trash is prohibited in NY anyway, so I think it would be best not to. If I carry it in I can carry it out and that has worked for me so far.
Zach
Zach is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2016, 06:28 PM   #98
Justin
Moving along
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 5,677
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zach View Post
Outdoor burning of trash is prohibited in NY anyway, so I think it would be best not to. If I carry it in I can carry it out and that has worked for me so far.
Zach
Sucks being in the minority!
At least we're up to half.

Justin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2016, 11:49 AM   #99
mike
Member
 
mike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Syracuse, NY
Posts: 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
Sucks being in the minority!
At least we're up to half.

whatever booger burner
__________________
mike
mike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2016, 04:19 PM   #100
Justin
Moving along
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 5,677
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike View Post
whatever booger burner

One of my favorite things to do after a long hike is to sit next to a warm campfire, and clip my overgrown toenails & toss the clippings into the fire (toe cheese & all) and watch it all burn & melt...talk about gooey!
Justin is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:13 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

DISCLAIMER: Use of these forums, and information found herein, is at your own risk. Use of this site by members and non-members alike is only granted by the adkhighpeak.com administration provided the terms and conditions found in the FULL DISCLAIMER have been read. Continued use of this site implies that you have read, understood and agree to the terms and conditions of this site. Any questions can be directed to the Administrator of this site.