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Old 07-09-2016, 12:05 PM   #1
adk
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Foolish Bill to hunt Adirondack Moose

Senator Patrick M. Gallivan is proof that politicians are completely out of touch about wildlife. He has been scheming an Adirondack Moose hunt for years and now has had it approved. Its a shame, a travesty and an example of a bought out & of touch politician. My only hope is the voters put him on unemployment as he does not deserve the publics trust! http://www.adirondackdailyenterprise....html?nav=5003

Where on Earth is the common sense? Northern states are dramatically backing off Moose hunting as well as Southern Canada because of their populations crashing. Our endangered, tiny struggling Moose population now has to add this foolish unnecessary hunting pressure to the current road strikes, unpredictable climate, brain worm and as reported in every neighboring state winter ticks (an effect of climate change). What in the world are you thinking and shame on you!
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Old 07-09-2016, 01:04 PM   #2
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depending upon who and how this is being presented and carried out - this can be done in a way acceptable to all.

some states have used a lottery system to hold a small hunt for a limited number of animals to be killed.
perhaps only 50 animals or less to be killed and only certain bulls that would fit the criteria.
if the nysdec receives the proceeds then it would be a good thing for an agency that receives such a miniscule percentage of the nys budget.

here's another link that's accessible -
https://www.nysenate.gov/newsroom/pr...nting-new-york
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Old 07-09-2016, 01:38 PM   #3
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If it's a lottery for a permit to hunt moose then anyone opposed to it could still apply for a permit and then not hunt them. For myself I'd be inclined to apply for a license to have "just in case". I most likely would not go specifically hunting for moose however if I came upon one during open deer season (and if it was open moose season) I'd have a decision to make...
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Old 07-09-2016, 03:50 PM   #4
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Ain't gonna happen.
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Old 07-09-2016, 11:39 PM   #5
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I would let the population grow and stabilize. It's a great joy to see them. If you want to hunt moose go to where they are more plentiful like Northwestern States or Alaska. I doubt whether the population has become a nuisance here although I am sure they are more prevalent in some areas than others. Perhaps someone should offer a poll so members here could voice their opinion via votes and we could have some hard data to share.
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Old 07-10-2016, 08:29 AM   #6
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I do believe the final say is up to DEC and I agree that it is way to early for a season. According to a wild life tech in Region 5 there will be no season until we have a breeding population of 2000.
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Old 07-10-2016, 08:45 AM   #7
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NY would have already have had a moose herd in excess of 2000 animals if the DEC would have had the funding to excelerate the moose recovery in the state. 20 -30 years ago the DEC had forums all over the state to introduce their excelerated moose recovery program ,that would have been funded by private donations.
It was well received in most every forum except the one in the capital district area. At that forum anti-hunting groups accused the DEC of wanting to increase the moose herd in NY, just so the state could generate revenue from a moose hunting season. The DEC tucked their tail between their legs and the program was scrapped. 30 years later, we still have less than 1000 moose in NY.
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Old 07-10-2016, 09:37 PM   #8
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I’m curious where the person who started this thread, and the ADK Daily Enterprise for that matter, got some actual figures on just how many moose there are in New York or the ADKs. I’d like to see some numbers because DEC openly admits that they don’t know. At best they estimate 500-800 statewide with most in the Adirondacks. There is currently a study in progress on moose in New York and an accurate population figure is one of the goals.
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Old 07-11-2016, 07:25 AM   #9
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Call Region 5 head quarters in Raybrook and ask to talk to one of the wildlife tech. Ryan Kelly does most of the tagging and tracking.
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Old 07-11-2016, 02:58 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by adkman12986 View Post
Call Region 5 head quarters in Raybrook and ask to talk to one of the wildlife tech. Ryan Kelly does most of the tagging and tracking.
I've attended numerous R5 Fish and Wildlife Management Board meetings and am in constant contact with DEC. I've yet to hear anyone say there's too few or too many when they report on the current and ongoing moose study.

You can’t consider a hunting season until you have an accurate take on the population. But, if the population can support it, which none of us really know yet if it can, then so be it. One thing that IS known about northern New York’s current moose population is that the animals are healthy compared to mid-western states like Minnesota.

‘Doubtful that hunting would occur anytime soon. If moose populations continue to grow to the point where they conflict with humans, who are not going away, then a hunting season is inevititable, just as it came to be in Maine, New Hampshire and Vermont. It is likely just a matter of time before there is a human fatality in a moose/vehicle crash up here.

What recent proposed moose management legislation would do more than anything is put it in the hands of DEC where it belongs, rather then that of politicians. However, these types of bills have passed the Senate in the past but don’t go far in the Assembly. For now, at least they’re thinking about the future and the possiblity of a hunting season if and when it is ever needed as a management tool.

I’m not aware of any push for such thing in the hunting community, although I'm sure many (including myself) would apply for a permit.
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Old 07-11-2016, 03:59 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Tug Hill View Post
NY would have already have had a moose herd in excess of 2000 animals if the DEC would have had the funding to excelerate the moose recovery in the state. 20 -30 years ago the DEC had forums all over the state to introduce their excelerated moose recovery program ,that would have been funded by private donations.
I had a conversation with someone in the DEC who was heavily involved in those discussions and the proposed recovery program, and what he told me was that outside of a few hunting groups, few people wanted an accelerated recovery program. Even most local leaders/politicians, he said, were lukewarm to the idea, telling them - both on and off record - that they were fine if Moose came back on their own... but that they saw no need to push the issue or make a special attempt to re-introduce them faster, no matter where the money was coming from.
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Old 07-11-2016, 04:56 PM   #12
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I had a conversation with someone in the DEC who was heavily involved in those discussions and the proposed recovery program, and what he told me was that outside of a few hunting groups, few people wanted an accelerated recovery program. Even most local leaders/politicians, he said, were lukewarm to the idea, telling them - both on and off record - that they were fine if Moose came back on their own... but that they saw no need to push the issue or make a special attempt to re-introduce them faster, no matter where the money was coming from.
Yes, and there in lies the problem, "local leaders, and politicians," are they trained biologists ? These people have screwed up the rest of society, so why not let them screw up NY 's wildlife management. It was all about moose /motor vehicle collision concerns. There will be moose/motor vehicle conflicts if the moose come back on their own or if they come back with a excelerated recovery program.
Local leaders and politicians in
ME, VT, and NH are living with their moose herds, and they are loving the revenue the moose lotteries generate.
The island portion of NFLD has the highest concentration of moose in the world, and they were not indigenous, they were introduced there in the early 1900's.
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Old 07-12-2016, 09:16 AM   #13
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I'd like to see one first.. call me narcissistic .
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Old 07-12-2016, 03:00 PM   #14
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You narcissist................me too, I would like to see one.
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Old 07-12-2016, 04:21 PM   #15
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I'd like to see one first.. call me narcissistic .
Next time you're paddling in moose country just talk to them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8PhquikAqo
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Old 07-12-2016, 04:51 PM   #16
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Over the years , I have seen several on Tug Hill. All young bulls, harassing local dairy herds during the rut, that's why we need an excelerated recovery program, to bring in some cows for these Bulls. Don't think you can increase the moose herd having bull moose trying to breed Holstein cows ?
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Old 07-13-2016, 09:01 AM   #17
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Vermont Moose Lottery just announced:
http://www.adkforum.com/showthread.p...684#post247684
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Old 07-13-2016, 10:41 AM   #18
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Here's a another way to look at it...

Sell an unlimited amount of lottery chances to win one of 10 tags at $50 apiece. The ten lucky winners pay an additional $1,000 per tag. A conservative guess of 5,000 applicants for the ten tags would raise $260,000 and the success rate would probably be below 50%. Not to put a price tag on a wild animal but killing a handful of moose in exchange for a quarter million dollars or more could benefit the overall population enormously.

This assumes that 100% of revenue generated would go to moose research instead of the general fund.
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Old 07-13-2016, 04:57 PM   #19
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Yes, 5000 applicants is definitely on the conservative side. Maine moose lottery usually has in excess of 50,000 applicants annually, for a chance at between 2000 - 3000 permits.
PA has around 20,000 applicants annually for around 50 elk permits each fall, and that's with a elk herd of less than 500 animals.
Same with KY elk permits but don't know exact numbers, but KY has around 15,000 elk, largest herd east of the Mississippi.
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Old 07-14-2016, 08:30 AM   #20
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Our endangered, tiny struggling Moose population now has to add this foolish unnecessary hunting pressure to the current road strikes, unpredictable climate, brain worm and as reported in every neighboring state winter ticks (an effect of climate change). What in the world are you thinking and shame on you!
Your claim that the moose is an endangered species is completely false.
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